Presidential Scandal Talk Of The Town

They shuffled in, shaking their umbrellas dry and lightly stomping their feet. The newspaper rack at Steve's Fremont News was nearing empty, and buyers pored over their papers even as they paid for them. One woman said under her breath: "I can't believe how hard it hit me."

It's been that way for a lot of folks this week. There is scandal - sex, lies, audiotape - and there is the joking and gossip that have come with all the earlier clouds over President Clinton.

But this time, there is more.

While some casually cast aside allegations that the president had an affair with a White House intern and then told her to lie about it - "His problems don't affect me" - others were so startled by Clinton's nervousness on national television that they liken it to the first time they saw their mother, once strong and unyielding, cry.

Here are some conversations with Seattle-area residents:

At Todd Shipyards on the Duwamish Waterway, Allen Rainsberger folded his calloused hands and explained why he cannot overlook Clinton's alleged misconduct.

"It's a very big deal. He's in a position of power as president of the U.S., and he definitely took advantage of that power," said the 40-year-old Seattle native.

Rainsberger, a Republican, realizes that what Clinton is accused of doing is nothing new. Other presidents have been known to have adulterous affairs, but in most cases, that news was hidden during their presidencies.

"I'm sure Watergate had something to do with it," Rainsberger said. "That was the last time we thought the president was invincible. There used to be a kind of super-protection and a good-old-boys network that looked the other way, but I don't think people are willing to cover up as much as they would in the old days."

Still, he was not entirely sorry to see the scandal. "This may do more damage to (Vice President Al) Gore and that's good news. We need a Republican president next term."

Jim D'Anna waited at a Fremont bus stop, poring, with scowling eyes, over the front page of a national newspaper's story about the turmoil around the White House.

An "old-time Harry Truman" liberal, D'Anna stroked his big, white beard and said he felt disgusted by the allegations against the president. Even if Clinton is found to have broken the law, D'Anna, 63, said he's not sure that would even matter to him.

"I don't care about the sex and his private life. People say that if you lie about this then you're probably going to lie about that. But I'm not sure that's true. As the president, he might have to lie to do his job. . . .

"He really wants to be a good president."

D'Anna concedes reluctance on his part to believe the allegations because he is staunchly liberal.

"I really do feel that no president has been attacked the way he has . . . because of his political beliefs," D'Anna said.

But even so, D'Anna said, "If he lies, then he should be punished. I would be (angry) at the people who drove him from his job and I would also be (angry) with him. I'd think, `You really screwed up. You really, really screwed up.' "

Christian Resource Center co-owner Kay Hooks stared at the headlines through her wire-rimmed glasses, then shook her head.

The owner of the religious book and music store in Seattle's Central Area doesn't want to believe Clinton had an affair.

"What is this teaching our young people?" she asked. "It seems like scandal is becoming so commonplace. You look around and wonder who's next."

"It seems our standards as a nation have gone downhill so fast. It really diminishes confidence," she said. "The Scripture says, `Be sure your sins will find you out.' "

At The Java Club, a decidedly non-yuppie coffeehouse on Aurora Avenue North in Seattle, a young, working-class crowd milled outside smoking and drinking coffee - the old-fashioned kind.

"I'm happy to have a president who can get laid," volunteered Jeff Pfetzing, 28, who works on the audio crew at a radio station. "I really mean that. I like the president because he's a real human being."

Beside him, Chris Stroud, 26, an unemployed former construction worker and bar bouncer wearing a constellation of earrings, offered a differing view.

"It matters because he's married. It's supposed to be the most sacred thing - marriage. If he's cheating on his wife, then he's willing to do other things."

In any case, he said, Clinton should own up to whatever he's done. "Honesty is the key to the whole thing. It's going to go away a lot faster if he tells the truth. I'd respect him more."

John Saba, a 46-year-old musical-instrument-repair technician, was discussing with a colleague how embarrassing it was for the president to be meeting with world leaders while having to answer titillating questions about his sex life.

"It's humiliating," the other man said.

Saba takes a sympathetic view, too.

"I think (Clinton's) job is a special job and because of that he should have access to special treatment and not face the potential for investigation until he's out of office," Saba said. "The general public may not need to have access to the president's personal life unless it affects them directly.

"Anybody who wants to be in charge the way he is has a character flaw anyway. It's a killer job, and he is a human being."

And it is in President Clinton's very humanness, the saxophone-playing baby boomer who loves burgers and fries, that his problems are rooted, Saba figures.

"With President Kennedy, I think people saw him and his family, for better or worse, as American royalty. Bill Clinton is a regular guy. . . . He will make mistakes."

It goes on all the time, and I'm old enough to know," said Fay Whitney, an 84-year-old attending a 50th anniversary luncheon at the Mercer Island Community Center.

Whitney, a Clinton supporter, said the current scandal is not a big deal for her. People should be concerned over whether Clinton is doing his job leading the country and should not be placing his personal life under a microscope.

"I think you could dig this stuff up on anyone alive today," Whitney said. "I mean, would you really want everything in your life exposed?

"Besides, these gals are probably throwing themselves at him."

Suzan Wilson, a 45-year-old private practice psychotherapist in West Seattle, was getting her hair dyed at the salon and seemed to want only to talk about the Clinton chaos.

"It's the biggest news of all time," she announced.

So big that Wilson felt compelled to engage in a media marathon to keep up with the latest stories. She watched the evening news, the 11 o'clock news, CNN news and Larry King Live just to cover her bases. This morning, she picked up new facts on the radio and through the gossip mill.

Wilson voted for Clinton, and still believes in him, but slowly, his mistakes are chipping away at her faith in him.

That the president could be engaged in unseemly situations should come as no surprise to anyone, Wilson said.

"What president hasn't had indiscretions?" she asked.

The problem with Clinton, she said, was that he got caught. Again. And again. Again.

"He has this attitude that he's impenetrable, just thinking he's above reproach," said Wilson, wife of an attorney and mother of a 3-year-old son. "It's going to take him down if he's not careful."

Alan Kim says that in Korea, where he was born, allegations of sexual improprieties among government leaders are not usually aired publicly.

"Nobody talks about it," said the 39-year-old owner of Jackson Cleaners in the Central Area.

That's the way it should be, says Kim's customer, John Ogwel, a Kenya native who has lived in Seattle for a decade.

"I'd like to see the hands of those men who have never done anything like that," says Ogwel, also 39, who says he's also a minister. "Maybe (the public) should get a priest or a pope as president."

Larry Springer, strolling near the Court House in downtown Everett, was clearly bothered by the news.

"I'm kind of disappointed by all this," said the lifelong Democrat. "There just seems to be so much of this sort of thing with him."

Still, Springer said, he's bothered also that the allegations are overshadowing stories such as the historic visit to Cuba by Pope John Paul II or Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat's meeting with Clinton yesterday.

"You know, I've never had a reporter walk up to me on the street and ask me what I think about Middle East peace," he said.

At a paint store on Aurora Avenue North, Joanne Delligan, a swatch of cloth over her shoulder, mulled over the pale-green color she'd selected for the bedroom in the Lake City home she shares with her husband, Ed, 71, who sheepishly admitted he liked the old color just fine.

Both say they are worried about the reputation of the presidency and Clinton's part in damaging that reputation.

As Joanne picked a bit of lint from his plaid wool shirt, Ed explained his belief that the president "is supposed to be a high-class person, not one who has a background of innuendo." Independent voters, the Delligans voted for Republican George Bush against Clinton, as well as for Democrat Gary Locke for governor.

Joanne says it's Clinton's apparent lying that bothers her most. "There are other things in his administration he hasn't been truthful about," she says, although she doesn't remember specifics.

They admit their view might be colored by having recently seen "Wag the Dog," a cynical film about political advisers who fake a war to distract public attention from accusations of presidential sexual misconduct.

"You wonder: How much of this really does happen?" said Joanne, who taught school and collected data for the Consumer Price Index before retiring.

As active Catholics, the two say morality is important to them. But just as important, they say, is the president's image, although they concede an alleged affair probably doesn't tarnish his reputation elsewhere in the world. "I don't think the overseas leaders care," said Joanne. "They all do the same thing." Up Aurora a bit, at Butch's Gun Shop, owner Butch Hulit, 56, a staunch Republican, had this to say about Clinton's sex life: "I don't care."

His wife, Kerri Hulit, 37, who also works at the shop, agrees, registering her discontent with what she considers media overkill by officially refusing to talk about it.

"I have no comment on the issue because I refuse to add fuel to the fire," she said.

For a lot of reasons, says Butch, Bush was a better president. But the focus on Clinton's sex life, he says, is misplaced.

It's to Clinton's credit, he says, that if he did have an affair, he attempted to be discreet about it.

"As long as he doesn't seem to be a sexual deviate, it doesn't have a lot to do with his presidency," he said. "I'm not saying it's a natural thing to do, but it happens. This is not earth-shaking."

Shamas Rai said he, like most of the customers who frequent his University District tobacco shop, is "tired of hearing about Clinton getting attacked."

"I say, `So what'? It does not matter to me what Clinton does with his personal life. It's a free country. If other people did not care, he wouldn't have to be accused of asking somebody to lie for him."

But like so many others who said they don't care, Rai, 43, quickly moved on to revealing that he does.

Hearing about Clinton's troubles, Rai said, was akin to seeing his mother cry for the first time: watching somebody he saw as strong and powerful suddenly appear weak and vulnerable.

It's an unsettling feeling, he said.

"Clinton is very good around the world. He does a very good job with foreign policy and I think he is a good president," said Rai, who is from Pakistan.

"I came to this country because I really like it here and because it is a strong country. Now it looks like it is weak."

Seattle Times staff reporters Matthew Ebnet, Christine Clarridge, Keiko Morris, Putsata Reang, Carol M. Ostrom, Stephen Clutter and Charles E. Brown contributed to this report.